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What are we paying for?
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Middenrat
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Joined: 10 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:47 pm    Post subject: What are we paying for? Reply with quote

I mean, what was the point of commissioning a new server? It gets no attention from the Admins unless they want to use it for a Comp, then it's put back in the cupboard with all the other old toys. The tracks are an insult to all the hard work being put in by the trackbuilding community, with any old tat deemed good enough and barely sufficient to keep a three hour rotation going.

Fresh new Admin needed here methinks, the current crop don't want to do the graft Laughing

Anyone else feeling short-changed?
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DanTheMan



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone feel short changed by an admin up and leaving with no word of saying so, probably over a silly joke, then changing servers around as "they" feel fit and complaining at any moment, making snide remarks about the running of GP`s, then complaining about things.

YOU STILL HAVE ADMIN, YOU DO IT!!!
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mad
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ooooo ooooo boys boys...

yes, we are short of some admins at the moment and I'm way too short of time to get on top of the crisis. Mid, I still respect your judgement and hard graft in the past. If you want to get folk involved or help organise the admin then great, I'm open to suggestions. Be positive and we can get it sorted. It's not from lack of interest or commitment, it's simply that *#*#* happens and sometime soon I'll maybe have time to explain my absence.

On the point of using it for comps.. it's the only server capable of holding all the troops at once as forever sucks bandwidth way more than old nations used to.. this is the main reason we need a fully paid up pro hosted server.
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Spanky_McCoy
Dirty Deeds Done Cheap(ish)


Joined: 13 Aug 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2009 10:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in two minds here, on one hand the track rotations aren't what they once were but that's partly my fault as I occasionally change them after moans and groans that they need changing funnily enough from people who are quite capable of changing them. While I accept my selections of tracks are limited to the tracks I know of and not some of the newer ones the track list is getting changed. Now if egos and griping get out of the road hows about being a big boy, picking up your dummy and helping out instead of moaning or of course you could give up the admin powers and moan purely from the punters perspective then I might have a tad more respect for the complaint.
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evil_homer
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Joined: 10 Jun 2008
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think now we've got the new server we should drop the challenge server, if your planning on running the gp's and solo cup on GBR anyway. even the adventure chat and stick to the two main servers.

Dan and Spanky (as well as others) have been working hard on the servers, the first few solos there was a few problems setting it all up but they persevered and its been fun and they've kept the forum alive.
Mid has put a lot of time and effort in in the past so i value his opinion, he's also earned the right imo to be an admin forever

if the rotation is not going to be changed so often stick to the great tracks we have, Flinger, House Dash, A Racing Line, Death Proof etc etc etc and just add a few of the better newer ones.
my 2p

also could we put something ingame that lets people know about the forum, i know theres an address in the top corner but something on the chat bar perhaps Question
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DaCheese



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some shoreforums Madverts perhaps? Here's a plan of action for speeding up playlist changes. Not much of it is feasible probably but it's nearly 2 o'clock at night and some ideas wouldn't go amiss here.

Putting together a track playlist takes a long time before you factor in not being able to remember a track what a track's like from its name. Step one of speeding things up is to clean up the track folders because nobody knows what's any good or whether a track's in the right place and there's still plenty of non-Stadium tracks in the list. Seeing as I'm not really doing much at the moment, send me a zip file of the whole damn lot. Got some painting to do this week I think and my life isn't completely free of any other responsibility but I'll get through them all soon enough, faster if I work with Baino who'd already started work on this kind of thing.

Step 2: Organise the good stuff properly, catalogue it so playlists can be made in a several week rotation like Mid had going and chuck the rest. The idea would be to try and get a fairly even spread of each builder's tracks in each playlist so if a builder has 13 tracks and we have 6 lists, they always have two tracks up. If they made a new track, it'd go into the list after the one with 3 up. Adding new tracks would get pretty complicated as a record of which playlist authors last had a track of theirs put in would be needed.

Instead of an author getting one folder, each list gets a folder. All tracks in a playlist are in alphabetical order on the controller and can be selected, added and randomised far more quickly than the average playlist change now. Eventually the playlists will get a bit long and some messing about would be needed to add another playlist, but that how long it'd take to reach that stage depends on what you guys think is a reasonable number of tracks to have in rotation at once.

An even faster way to change playlists would be to have a feature of the controller that could read in text files containing track filenames or file references, but saying that's easier said than done would be a reasonable bet for a win in the understatement of the year competition. I've never used Java and couldn't program my way out of a paper bag with VB6; other than that, I'd have a go! Considering you already have a lot on your plate though Mad (surefire competition win) asking you to code something along these lines would be massively unfair.

There we have it. A long post full of daft ideas hastily typed late at night. Let the picking at holes in my plan commence!
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Middenrat
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mad, Evil, thanks for the acknowledgements Smile
Spanky and Dan - and Steve and the other backroom boys - really have kept the show on the road and the Forum functioning. I hope they understand now what it feels like to be at the coalface and if there is some criticism, at least they haven't been ridiculed on the side, which is more than I was going to put up with for trying to share my interests away from computer gaming i.e. railway modelling. A case of selective amnesia presents in their posts above so let me remind and inform: I had to delete two threads in the Other Interests section after they were swamped by mockery, even after hints that I was quite prepared to 'spit my dummy out'. I pulled my head in after that, aye, and gave up farming the Forum if it's that narrow in scope.
All of which had me backed into a corner, but I've kicked this discussion off to try and get the server back to its once-dominant position in UK laps, not work over the past.
Evil has started with a sensible suggestion in proposing to spread ourselves less thinly (and confusingly to new visitors) by shutting down the rarely-used Challenge, I agree. The whole kaboodle won't be so daunting then.
DC has hit a row of nails on the head and I hope he will forge a taskbusting team with Baino, I love it when a plan comes through.
A couple of hours ago I was wondering what the hell to do, DC's post makes things plainer for me, cheers skipper Arrow
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DanTheMan



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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Middenrat wrote:
Mad, Evil, thanks for the acknowledgements Smile
Spanky and Dan - and Steve and the other backroom boys - really have kept the show on the road and the Forum functioning. I hope they understand now what it feels like to be at the coalface and if there is some criticism, at least they haven't been ridiculed on the side, which is more than I was going to put up with for trying to share my interests away from computer gaming i.e. railway modelling. A case of selective amnesia presents in their posts above so let me remind and inform: I had to delete two threads in the Other Interests section after they were swamped by mockery, even after hints that I was quite prepared to 'spit my dummy out'. I pulled my head in after that, aye, and gave up farming the Forum if it's that narrow in scope.
All of which had me backed into a corner, but I've kicked this discussion off to try and get the server back to its once-dominant position in UK laps, not work over the past.
Evil has started with a sensible suggestion in proposing to spread ourselves less thinly (and confusingly to new visitors) by shutting down the rarely-used Challenge, I agree. The whole kaboodle won't be so daunting then.
DC has hit a row of nails on the head and I hope he will forge a taskbusting team with Baino, I love it when a plan comes through.
A couple of hours ago I was wondering what the hell to do, DC's post makes things plainer for me, cheers skipper Arrow


I have no selective memory, I POSTED A PICTURE OF THOMAS THE TANK ENGINE AND SAID IT WAS STEVIE M`s. Booo Hooo,

Grow up, put your dummy back in. i wouldn`t expect this off a kid, microphone still broken is it?
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DaCheese



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That'll do, let's improve the server instead of arguing.
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StevieM



Joined: 14 Jul 2009
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dump the challenge server and bring back Madlaps Mini server!!

wooo



[sorry Very Happy]
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DaCheese



Joined: 05 Sep 2007
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Location: GMR Towers, South Shropshire, UK.

PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 1:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In order to have a mini server, you need mini tracks, and I think we discussed that elsewhere Wink .
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evil_homer
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 1:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i'd also remove the box for mad laps pro from the home page now its gone
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mark-s
PRO Admin


Joined: 25 Nov 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sorry all be back soon, still waiting for internet to be installed. Crying or Very sad
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Middenrat
actual speed


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mark-s wrote:
sorry all be back soon, still waiting for internet to be installed. Crying or Very sad

Glad to hear it Marks.
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Spanky_McCoy
Dirty Deeds Done Cheap(ish)


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

evil_homer wrote:
i think now we've got the new server we should drop the challenge server, if your planning on running the gp's and solo cup on GBR anyway. even the adventure chat and stick to the two main servers.


The challenge server isn't getting used, even when I was doing the 15 lap races they could have been done on the main server. So getting shot of it isn't a problem in my opinion.

evil_homer wrote:
Dan and Spanky (as well as others) have been working hard on the servers, the first few solos there was a few problems setting it all up but they persevered and its been fun and they've kept the forum alive.
Mid has put a lot of time and effort in in the past so i value his opinion, he's also earned the right imo to be an admin forever


I've got no problem with Mid being an admin if he wants to be a team player, there was a better way to bring up his concerns and ideas than this and to stand back like he isn't involved and take pot shots at the rest of us unhelpful and hardly constructive. If one admin has an issue with another then PM it, this stuff could be done without all the hassle.

evil_homer wrote:
if the rotation is not going to be changed so often stick to the great tracks we have, Flinger, House Dash, A Racing Line, Death Proof etc etc etc and just add a few of the better newer ones.
my 2p


Cheese and Baino are working (or going to be) on the track list so hopefully we can pare them down to 4-5 extended lists and remove the tracks that don't cut it. It would be an idea to change the track list weekly so that the regulars don't get bored with it. You're right enough though a classic Mad Laps core should be kept in all track lists in my opinion which is what I tried to do when I was selecting tracks which in my defence was being done in a hurry usually right after GP's.

evil_homer wrote:
also could we put something ingame that lets people know about the forum, i know theres an address in the top corner but something on the chat bar perhaps Question


Good idea, the events in particular are driven from the forums so we'd get more interest and more sign ups if people popped by. Should be a relatively easy thing to do.

What we all need to remember though is that Mad tends to need to do a lot of this stuff and those of us that speak to him know he is incredibly busy with his business without that there is no Mad Laps, let us not forget how much he has done and continues to do to let us have somewhere to play games so when criticism comes his way just remember he could take a strop and shut the whole thing down so lets not push our luck.
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Baino
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Joined: 27 May 2008
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Spanky_McCoy"]
evil_homer wrote:
i think now we've got the new server we should drop the challenge server, if your planning on running the gp's and solo cup on GBR anyway. even the adventure chat and stick to the two main servers.

Spanky_McCoy wrote:

The challenge server isn't getting used, even when I was doing the 15 lap races they could have been done on the main server. So getting shot of it isn't a problem in my opinion.


I'd agree with shutting it if only to maybe reduce the cost to Mad because I was horrified to learn how much it has been costing to run the Points and Challenge servers especially when you consider how little they can be used a lot of the time.


evil_homer wrote:
if the rotation is not going to be changed so often stick to the great tracks we have, Flinger, House Dash, A Racing Line, Death Proof etc etc etc and just add a few of the better newer ones.
my 2p

Spanky_McCoy wrote:

Cheese and Baino are working (or going to be) on the track list so hopefully we can pare them down to 4-5 extended lists and remove the tracks that don't cut it. It would be an idea to change the track list weekly so that the regulars don't get bored with it. You're right enough though a classic Mad Laps core should be kept in all track lists in my opinion which is what I tried to do when I was selecting tracks which in my defence was being done in a hurry usually right after GP's.


I have started on this unfortunately it's proven tricky to go through the tracks without interruption and have often ended up racing instead often against old timers who randomly appear after months away.Very Happy But the real problem has been that I seem to crash the server if I start going through the tracks so I've kinda been scarred off going through the tracks whilst they are on the server so I believe that Mid is looking into the possibility of getting a zip of the tracks together so I can go through them that way.

evil_homer wrote:
also could we put something ingame that lets people know about the forum, i know theres an address in the top corner but something on the chat bar perhaps Question

Spanky_McCoy wrote:

Good idea, the events in particular are driven from the forums so we'd get more interest and more sign ups if people popped by. Should be a relatively easy thing to do.

What we all need to remember though is that Mad tends to need to do a lot of this stuff and those of us that speak to him know he is incredibly busy with his business without that there is no Mad Laps, let us not forget how much he has done and continues to do to let us have somewhere to play games so when criticism comes his way just remember he could take a strop and shut the whole thing down so lets not push our luck.

Seems like we should try to direct people to the forums as I know that often if you tell people during racing that there is a comp going to happen they are often interested and will then go and sign up to the forum so they can enter.
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Last edited by Baino on Mon Jul 27, 2009 8:11 am; edited 1 time in total
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DaCheese



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If we can get a zip of the tracks sorted, how should the sortout work? Go through them all, list the ones you reckon are worth keeping by author and the ones that need to go perhaps, then compare thoughts and stick the resulting list of tracks that are "at risk" up so people can pick through and present a case for keeping something in the track pool? A lot of what we'll dig out for removal will be rubbish but our verdict won't cover everone's opinions so something like that might be an idea.

Going back to the recording which playlist a builder's most recent track was added to, perhaps a stickied post in the tracks forum could be produced with the names of all builders in it. Anybody who adds tracks would need to be a mod in that forum section so they could update it after adding tracks. Tight testing on new tracks might be an idea to avoid multiple versions of the same track as I know this is a big problem at the moment. I know it's hard to test thoroughly enough to iron out every last problem and I'm as guilty of having to update as anyone. Fortunately I think there's not really much that needs to be changed with testing as Matt has being doing excellent work on testing recently (thanks Matt, and sorry I've not been trying more of the recent efforts).
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Baino
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 10:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well at the moment I was just going through the tracks sorting out the ones that had obvious problems like a Christmas theme, badly placed or missing cp's, missing custom graphics or if there's a newer version available. I've also been trying to sort them into fatlap and minilaps for the most part i've been trying to avoid deciding on the actual quality of the track as this should really be decided by a wider range of people than just one or two so there's something for everybody when they go on a madlaps server
Once the chaff has been weeded out. we can upload the rest to the servers for people to go through perhaps useing the servers voting system to get feedback. I know that currently only a few people vote on the tracks and according to Mad you wouldn't want a server made up of what's got good karma at the moment but if everyone was to make sure they voted on every track they raced then it would surely work a lot better.
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DaCheese



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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That does sound like a better way of doing it, good idea Baino.
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Middenrat
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Baino wrote:
believe that Mid is looking into the possibility of getting a zip of the tracks together so I can go through them that way..


sorry no can do.
While I have a .zip snapshot of all tracks it is at least a year old and larger than can be enclosed in an email. The structure of the folder is cool and could still be worth updating, so a filehost might be found if anyone still interested.
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